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#31
05-20-06, 10:27am
habeeb
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Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Cape Town, South Africa
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Quote:
Originally Posted by witchazel
Hello,
I was just wondering if those pinbar trading instructions might be out and about somewhere
Hi witchazel,
everything you need to know about pin bars is in the educational
material. You'll only start getting a feel for them once you practice
trading them.
Is there anything particular about Pin Bars that you don't understand?
Take Care
Habeeb
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#32
05-20-06, 11:38am
witchazel
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pinbar
no, im a dummy
i dinna finish reading all the board before i posted
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#33
05-20-06, 12:20pm
habeeb
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Quote:
Originally Posted by witchazel
no, im a dummy
i dinna finish reading all the board before i posted
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#34
05-24-06, 7:58pm
great*dane
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pinbar trading instructions
Quote:
Originally Posted by witchazel
Hello,
I was just wondering if those pinbar trading instructions might be out and about somewhere
There are 2 pretty good compilation pdfs on pinbars in the "General Discussion" section posted by Iwoo034 a few days ago: http://www.forexfactory.com/forexfor...ead.php?t=5488
Hope this helps.
Dane
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#35
07-29-06, 6:55pm
Snuffleupagus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by habeeb
Hi Wizard,
Your thinking is a bit flawwed (no offence). Basing your "take profit"
level according to your stop, doesn't make sense. Take your profit as
you feel comfortable. If
you're happy with 20 pips, then the size of your stop shouldn't bother
you. Even if you had a 100 pip stop, and you made a small profit ...
hey... it's a profit ... take it.
With regard to Jim's 20 - 30 pip profit. When you're playing a daily
pin bar, your initial stop will be above the daily pin. You enter your
trade on the break of the pin. Majority of the time, price will move 20-30pips in your favour. By this time you would've moved your stop to breakeven.
The huge stops on the daily's scares me to bits. So, I just use it as
direction. I scroll through the lower time frames, to enter a trade in
the direction of the daily pin, keeping my stops small. Here's a chart
For this thread it seems an increase of leverage is being
proposed. Increased leverage is a double-edged sword. It can produce
big profits...and big losses. If it is increased yet low enough to
survive your biggest drawdown it can make more money. Also if the
risk/reward is not matching the overall win percentage it will
breakeven or lose in the long term.
This touches upon what I have recently seen as a barrier for my
trading. I had a nice win streak, but one loss can wipe it out. My
risk/reward ratio seems to be a limiting factor. I also find myself try
to push my +ve pips further in a trade so the r/r ratio works out. I
can see that as being dangerous if I am artificially pushing my trades
like that.
Example: For simplicity, let's say each daily pin trade has a 200 pip
SL. If I take profit at 100 pips each time then that means for every
loss I need 2 wins just to break even. That is a 66% win percentage I
need to have just to breakeven. It is worse if I close half the
position to lock profits at the lower level like 50 pips. That would
make the average win 75 pips. For every 3 losses I would need 8 wins to
BE (~73% win %).
So let's apply this to the bolded parts of the quote above (not trying to pick on you Habeeb
). It may not hit the stop a "majority of the time", but it doesn't
need to hit the SL many times for it to wipe out the wins. It seems
like a risk/reward issue.
So how do we make this work for the idea in this thread (100 pips/increased leverage)?
TWOZ hit upon what I am saying. It was suggested we play the retrace
once the pin has been breached. Wouldn't doing this make the trade
riskier in terms of win percentage? If we trade pins on a lower
timeframe this would give us a lower SL in pips, but James has said
pins on lower timeframes are not as reliable. So this once again could
lower our overall win percentage.
Am I totally missing something here? I feel as if I am missing a small
component in my trading that is keeping me from making good consistent
profits. I am getting wins and executing rifle shot trades, but I don't
seem to be going anywhere.
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#36
07-31-06, 4:11am
The Wizard of Oz
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Getting there mate
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Location: Oz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus
...Am I totally missing something here? I feel as if I am missing a
small component in my trading that is keeping me from making good
consistent profits. I am getting wins and executing rifle shot trades,
but I don't seem to be going anywhere.
Join the club mate. i have been breaking even for over 18 months. not getting ahead at all.
Wiz.
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#37
07-31-06, 4:32am
lonespruce
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Location: Back in Oil Country - AB, Canada
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Money Management.
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"the brave may not live forever, but the cautious do not live at all" - unknown
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#38
07-31-06, 5:57am
Snuffleupagus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lonespruce
Money Management.
Not sure if your comment is directed at my post.
Could you be more specific?
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#39
07-31-06, 6:02am
Snuffleupagus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Wizard of Oz
Join the club mate. i have been breaking even for over 18 months. not getting ahead at all.
Wiz.
So far I am ahead this month. However, given the scenario in my
previous post in this thread, I am not sure if that will hold up in the
long term. I don't want to wait and see if the scenario eats my
account.
The idea James posted to start this thread really has me intrigued, but
I want to fully understand it before implementing it. High leverage can
be a friend and an enemy. I see it as a tool that works if properly
used. I just want to make sure I properly use it so my account does not
suffer.
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#40
07-31-06, 10:48am
SurfingWave
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus
So how do we make this work for the idea in this thread (100 pips/increased leverage)?
TWOZ hit upon what I am saying. It was suggested we play the retrace
once the pin has been breached. Wouldn't doing this make the trade
riskier in terms of win percentage? If we trade pins on a lower
timeframe this would give us a lower SL in pips, but James has said
pins on lower timeframes are not as reliable. So this once again could
lower our overall win percentage.
Am I totally missing something here? I feel as if I am missing a small
component in my trading that is keeping me from making good consistent
profits. I am getting wins and executing rifle shot trades, but I don't
seem to be going anywhere.
Hello Snuffle,
I think component your missing is ability to analyzed your position
size. we don't need to enter on the retrace of the pin. we only enter
our position on a pin bar. whats is our position size tells us? the
risk that we can afford emotionally. In my understanding, the T/P will
base on your analysis of the market, after you analyzed the market and
now you can conclude T/P ratios you apply. ex: your risk 100 pips and
you think the market is in good mood and it will move 200 pips in your
direction your T/P ratio will be 1:2. this ability takes alots of
patience, descipline, and practice. I am also a beginner in forex and I
take it one step at the time. I hope this will help.
__________________
“I can do all things through him who strengthens me.”.James16 Group
Life is simple, but human make it hard.
I am responsible every trade that I made win or lose. No one to blame, but myself.
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#41
07-31-06, 7:23pm
Snuffleupagus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SurfingWave
Hello Snuffle,
I think component your missing is ability to analyzed your position
size. we don't need to enter on the retrace of the pin. we only enter
our position on a pin bar. whats is our position size tells us? the
risk that we can afford emotionally. In my understanding, the T/P will
base on your analysis of the market, after you analyzed the market and
now you can conclude T/P ratios you apply. ex: your risk 100 pips and
you think the market is in good mood and it will move 200 pips in your
direction your T/P ratio will be 1:2. this ability takes alots of
patience, descipline, and practice. I am also a beginner in forex and I
take it one step at the time. I hope this will help.
Currently I risk 2% on my trades. For a pin I play it the
standard way, enter 5 to 10 pips after the break and the SL is just
past the end of the nose of the pin. So that determines the pips being
risked. Considering I use daily charts and higher, the SL's can be
large.
This goes back to my original post. If the SL is pre-determined then
the profit needs to be big enough for a good R/R ratio. Maybe James is
assuming there is a very good win ratio since he is talking about
"rifle shot" trades.
Maybe I am missing something...or I am just being pessimistic in
thinking my win % will not stay high consistently. I am hoping James
can shed some light on this. I am interested in this for my regular
trading and the concept he presented in this thread.
Snuffleupagus
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#42
07-31-06, 8:24pm
SurfingWave
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus
Currently
I risk 2% on my trades. For a pin I play it the standard way, enter 5
to 10 pips after the break and the SL is just past the end of the nose
of the pin. So that determines the pips being risked. Considering I use
daily charts and higher, the SL's can be large.
This goes back to my original post. If the SL is pre-determined then
the profit needs to be big enough for a good R/R ratio. Maybe James is
assuming there is a very good win ratio since he is talking about
"rifle shot" trades.
Hello Snuffle.
Let me ask you these? what is your analysis on that daily Pin bar
setup? do you think it will move on your directions? if so, Why? do you
know where are you resistance/ support area? I think we can only
conclude T/P ratio base on our analysis on the market. if worry so much
about your risking 2% of your account, cut your risk to 1%. in my demo
I always entered pin below 1% and my weekly pin is 1.28% so far doing
fair.
To enter trade is a predetermine on your position size and what the
market doing. if your risk is 2% of $3000 micro accnt =60 dollar
600pips right? now, you do all your analysis and your very confident on
your system and you know it will move 800pips on your direction. well..
ofcourse you take trade with caution.
__________________
“I can do all things through him who strengthens me.”.James16 Group
Life is simple, but human make it hard.
I am responsible every trade that I made win or lose. No one to blame, but myself.
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#43
07-31-06, 8:38pm
Snuffleupagus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SurfingWave
Hello Snuffle.
Let me ask you these? what is your analysis on that daily Pin bar
setup? do you think it will move on your directions? if so, Why? do you
know where are you resistance/ support area? I think we can only
conclude T/P ratio base on our analysis on the market. if worry so much
about your risking 2% of your account, cut your risk to 1%. in my demo
I always entered pin below 1% and my weekly pin is 1.28% so far doing
fair.
To enter trade is a predetermine on your position size and what the
market doing. if your risk is 2% of $3000 micro accnt =60 dollar
600pips right? now, you do all your analysis and your very confident on
your system and you know it will move 800pips on your direction. well..
ofcourse you take trade with caution.
Generally for price action trades I ride out the trade as long as
I can using price action, fibs, trendlines and S/R levels I identify on
the charts.
I am not worried about 2% risk. It is not a matter of how much I risk
if the R/R ratio is not favorable. Assuming I am not risking so much
that a big drawdown wipes out the account. If the R/R is not good then
the account will be negative in the long run. That is what I am looking
to resolve.
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#44
07-31-06, 11:50pm
SurfingWave
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus
Generally
for price action trades I ride out the trade as long as I can using
price action, fibs, trendlines and S/R levels I identify on the charts.
I am not worried about 2% risk. It is not a matter of how much I risk
if the R/R ratio is not favorable. Assuming I am not risking so much
that a big drawdown wipes out the account. If the R/R is not good then
the account will be negative in the long run. That is what I am looking
to resolve.
Hello it me again.
How do we know if the R/R ratio is not favorable? thru analysis of the
market using price ations, there is no guarantee it will go in your
way. it is important keep our position small as possible.
The Ideal R/R ratio are 1:1 , 1:1.5 and 1:2 etc. if your Rate of return
below ratio 1:.5 in 50/50 win/loss scenario your account will shrink
alot. It is easy to setup our R/R ratio. the hard part how get there
consistenly. for us beginners we need cut our risk to the smallest as
possible, because inperfect practice, make it perfect.
__________________
“I can do all things through him who strengthens me.”.James16 Group
Life is simple, but human make it hard.
I am responsible every trade that I made win or lose. No one to blame, but myself.
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#45
09-01-06, 10:24pm
hk334
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Quote:
Originally Posted by james16
The main point is this. You can grow an account quickly and at the same
time trade in a conservative manner. The best of both worlds.
I just wanted to say thanks! I took your definition of an "A"
trade from the 150 base and when the cable caught me in that little
hiccup last night (9/1/06) on the 60 min chart I was long and in 10
minutes I was way in the hole on both the cable and the Fiber. Before I
understood what the chart had to say I had closed the Fiber. Big
mistake. Both had touched the 150 ema. I loaded up on the cable and
went to bed, I was $1400 in the hole. When I woke up I had made 300+
pips on the cable over 5 full loads for a profit of about $3800. Was
fun! I have a new Jazz tune to write! "Ride the "A" trade".
Once again Thanks
hk334
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