PBS - THE GOOD WAR: Talkback









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Tell us what
you thinkSelected submissions will be posted here, so check back
regularly.1/24/02Rachel Krezinski [e-mail] am a
freshman at Occidental College, and a member of its Students United for
Peace club. I am often questioned about my reasons for promoting peace,
and on my alternative suggestions for the current war. I only managed to
catch a brief section of "The Good War" film, but it helped me to make
sense of some of my feelings about the war. I do wish for a peaceful
world, but I am also aware of the fact that war is difficult, if not
impossible to avoid. This film did a wonderful job of portraying the
people who were able to find a balance between the two opposites. I was
particularly moved by the story of the movie actor who gave up his
reputation in order to save his belief in peace, but did not denounce his
country or fellow Americans...he joined the war as a medic, as a person
who helps heal the wounds of war. 1/23/02I was interested in your documentary on COs.
As the friend of several Viet Nam era COs, I want my early 20s son to see
that this is a real option, especially during this time of "national
drawing-together." Why do so many feel that airing the flag and having an
ever-present lapel pin of the flag mean that we all have to support
bombing and killing? Were not those men who piloted those planes that
killed so many here in the US doing it in the name of a higher cause or
justice? Why must our young men also kill in the name of "justice," or be
scorned at the mention of questioning or refusal. The possibility of
dissent is a topic that is terribly upsetting to even friends and
neighbors. One fretted so much that he sent me an email telling me details
of the firemen's deaths in the twin towers, suggesting that my upset at
the US bombing in Afghanistan negated their contribution. Why must killing
lead to killing? Why must an evil means seemingly justify a good end?
1/23/02Cris Currie [e-mail] excellent,
long overdue program on a subject about which much more can and needs to
be said. I hope to see more about non-violence on PBS. Yes COs have to be
more courageous than soldiers, because it is much harder to buck the
prevailing sentiment than it is to go off to war, not knowing anything
about what you are getting into and naively thinking that everything will
be OK. Being against the so called war on terrorism is a case in point. I
am, and always will be, a war resister, and no matter what the war, it is
always very difficult. Instead of rallying around the shedding of blood, I
am engaged in teaching others how to resolve conflict non-violently. While
it often seems we know so little about non-violent conflict resolution, in
reality we know a great deal, but few have bothered to learn. Of course
there is much more that we need to know, but that is no excuse for not
doing all we can to conscientiously practice what we already know works.
Just because a few thousand American lives were lost on Sept. 11, doesn't
mean war is suddenly justified, because one's morality can't be defined
based on what happens only to Americans, provoked or not. If we truly
loved humanity, we would all be dedicating ourselves to learning and
practicing the ways of non-violence, every day, not just during times of
relative quiet or when our stock portfolios are reaching new highs. This
is what being a real CO is all about: learning, living, demonstrating,
practicing, experimenting with (not always successfully), and teaching a
better way, and doing one's best to never waver from that commitment and
vision, no matter what else may be happening in the world. How could one
possibly do more for one's country?? In comparison, dying is definitely an
overrated contribution. 1/23/02Marco Funk http://www.pbs.org/itvs/thegoodwar/[e-mail]
first would like to say that I have not seen the PBS program about the
CO's in WWII, but I would like to share a little about my thoughts on
pacifism and peacemaking.I am a Mennonite Christian and I am 21
years old. I have not had to 'apply' my CO status in any way, but I am
granted CO status by virtue of being a baptized Mennonite. The reason that
I am a pacifist is because Jesus was a pacifist. Simple as that. My
problem is that 95% of Christians don't take this aspect of Jesus'
character seriously, or they say that it isn't relevant for social ethics.
A modest proposal for peace: That all Christians will stop killing each
other!!! 1/21/02Lee H. Lybarger [e-mail] PBS
program was never aired in my local area (WOSU, Columbus, OH). How can I
purchase the video tape of it? I first learned about it in the N.Y.Times
1/13/02. I was a C.O. in the mid 1950's following the end of the Korean
War. I did alternative service for the Presbyterian Church in rural Puerto
Rico. I have now come to a more nuanced point of view after many years of
reading and reflecting especially on Reinhold Niebuhr's writings. My adult
children are all pacifists however. I father-in-law, out of his Mennonite
background, worked through the FOR with CPS volunteers at Wooster, OH
during W.W. II.((To purchase a home video copy of THE GOOD WAR And
Those Who Refused To Fight It, contact Transit Media: 800-343-5540, fax:
201-652-1973. For educational sales contact Bullfrog Films: 800-543-FROG,
fax: [phone], [e-mail])) 1/21/02Thank you for the excellent documentary.
Relatives of mine fought and died on both sides of WWII -- none refused to
fight. Though I am proud of them, and I still mourn those gassed at
Terazin and Auchwitz, I believe the story of their friends who wouldn't
kill must be heard -- especially today. Please rebroadcast "The Good War"
in primetime. Thanks again. 1/21/02Jo Ellyn Armstrong [e-mail] must add
my voice to those who expressed their puzzlement that Jehovah's Witnesses
were not even given a sidebar mention in a documentary on contentious
objectors. It seems that it is not politically correct to draw attention
to Jehovah's Witnesses or their completely neutral stand in all countries
in any war on any given day. They don't march, protest, or strike in the
name of pacifism as some do. The idea of peace does not need the Witnesses
to champion it any more than do the ideas of justice and love. What these
ideas do need is a presentation in a meaningful way that gives every human
being an equal seat at the table. Jehovah's Witnesses recognize that the
only force powerful enough to truly level the playing field for every man,
woman, and child on the planet is God. All the well-intentioned political
actions of the last century have not produced a more peaceful or secure
world. 9/11 was a powerful reminder that a few determined individuals
fueled by fanatical zeal can d estroy the hard won long-term
accomplishments of the multitudes in a matter of minutes. We have seen
millions of dollars along with precious lives and diligently thought out
plans expended for months now with far less than satisfactory results. The
evil remains and spreads, though many have been killed or maimed and an
entire country has been further rendered incapable of supporting its
citizens. All the technology, money, and rhetoric have not brought the
world, or any individual in it, a sense of security. Nor will a purely
pacifistic view of the world. Whatever love we may feel for our fellow
human beings is not strong enough to counteract the hate in some hearts or
the utter disregard a few have for the lives of those they do not know or
understand. Jehovah's Witnesses, therefore, are not strictly pacifists,
but they are realists. They look to God for what only God can do.
Thankfully, for all of us His Word contains ample proof that he intends to
do just what we all so desperately need...establish a true and lasting
peace among all peoples of the earth. Witnesses set and follow a living
example of their faith in His promises in their own congregations
throughout the world. They volunteer to share with their communities the
information they have seen tried, tested, and proven to work. Witnesses
were holding interracial Christian meetings in all corners of the world
before it ever became politically acceptable or socially sympathetic. They
were already in the concentration camps when the Jews began to arrive
because they did not support Hitler's militaristic or racist views. Their
magazines published exposes' against him in the United States for quite a
few years before this country entered the war. Some of the first
information available to the rest of the world about the death camps and
what was being done to Jews and others became known because Witnesses in
those camps provided maps and detailed accounts and accurate figures of
the deaths. They risked their lives to bring these atrocities to the
attention of the rest of mankind.It was very sad to hear the
resounding sound of silence in your documentary when it came to the record
of Jehovah's Witnesses as conscientious objectors. Entire families have
been sent to relocation camps by various governments in times past. Many
Witness women have faced brutal treatment right alongside their men
including death by every means conceivable because of their neutral stand
in the conflicts of men and nations. Witnesses continue to face harsh
treatment, from beatings to imprisonment, in a handful of countries in
21st century because of their courageous stand. It is amazing to
me that your documentary failed to note that the first contentious
objector executed by the Nazi's was one of Jehovah's Witnesses. That was
reported on in major newspapers in this country. How could anyone produce
a documentary on this subject without ever mentioning the contributions
and sacrifices of Jehovah's Witnesses? It is a shameful oversight in light
of the facts. I expected more from PBS. 1/18/02Lawrence Templin [e-mail] is
an excellent and well-conceived program. But I don't think that many of us
who were conscientious objectors during World War II were all that heroic,
as some of your responders seem to think. "Quixotic" might be the more
honest word---though I hasten to add that I am a great fan of Don Quixote.
However, I do think that the creators of the program were wise to focus on
the good and useful things that came out of the CO experience: a wider
awareness of the effectiveness of nonviolence, a pioneering role in the
civil rights movement, an active role in resisting the bad war of the
century (Vietnam), and reform of mental institutions. My friend Bill
Robert's words at the end of the program are an apt reminder of the
frequently expressed Biblical irony that prophesies the ultimate
foolishness of the wise and the wisdom of the foolish. 1/18/02larry bartlett http://www.pbs.org/itvs/thegoodwar/[e-mail]
was a child during the war, but since I believe it was the most important
event of the 20th century I have spent over 50 years learning about the
causes, effects and the incredible changes that period gave the world. Yet
in all my reading I have never before found out the story of this group of
brave people All the CO's could not be singled out in one hour, but it has
given me an entirely new area to research Just when I think I know
everything about the war, someone enlightens me how little I really know.
Thanks for opening new vistas to me I was an active member of CORE for
several years yet I never knew that anyone other than the late James
Farmer had helped to found it. 1/18/02Bob Harris [e-mail] thoroughly enjoyed
the program, and was unaware of the various medical experiments and other
tortuous conditions to which the WWII CO's were submitted. This was a
fascinating show.As a life long CO I appreciated the history. I
personally received my CO from the Selective Service in 1969, the first
and only one ever given in Bergen County New Jersey. As a matter of
interest while assited by the American Friends CCCO, and members of
various churches, I created my own religion based on the biological system
of nature. In this concept animals fight but rarely kill eacy other. This
is because they touch each other. When the contact is removed by the use
and training with weapons, the immorality of killing is introduced which
allows the depersonalization. So while killing is wrong, the training by
armies in the use of weapons, and the weapons themselves are immoral in
this system. I arrived at this belief after spending 5 months as a student
in Berlin while the wall was still in place. The support of the
Friends gave me the history of conscientious objection that I needed to
present my beliefs in cogent form. I chose to resist the Viet Nam War by
becoming a CO so that if anyone ever came to me wishing to be a CO, I
would be a legitimately recognized witness by the Selective Service
Board.Now I am wondering in these times when there is such strong
support for military action in Afghanistan, what is the best way to help
promote the idea of actively solving international situations with
peaceful means that don't involve the military. I would appreciate any
comments to me in this regard. These days my most political activity is
traveling around the world making kites with children to show them not all
Americans are hostile and warlike, and to interact with them to promote
peace, population control, and compassion. I sometimes wonder if this is
enough. (my activities are seen on my web pages http://www.bhc.com) In
Peace 1/18/02Cynthia Phillips [e-mail] you for
airing this important documentary. I've never understood why so many
people seemingly hate and despise those who are not willing to engage in
mass murder. I hope this documentary has gone some way in correcting
misconceptions about pacifism. I would like to add an important peace
group to those listed on your Resources page: The Women's International
League for Peace and Freedom. WILPF is one of the oldest peace groups in
the country. It was founded in 1915 in the Hague, Netherlands by women
from many different countries who had come together to protest the carnage
of World War I and to plan to work to avoid future wars. Jane Addams was
its first president. WILPF is still going strong after all these years and
works on issues broadly related to peace and social justice. The website
address for U.S. WILPF is "http:www.wilpf.org". 1/17/02It was refreshing to see more coverage of
those who oppose war, even a "just" war, on television. Three cheers for
all who contributed to this production. 1/17/02I don't intend to call the people who chose
not to fight cowards, but WWII was an important one for the U.S. to join.
Thier beliefs, although seeming right to them, were wrong. Killing is
never good, but sometimes it must be done to stop other killings. You
weren't going to liberate Europe or the Jews without shooting any Nazis. I
figure you want to show all sides, which is good. I am always eager to
learn more about history. I found it sad, though, that you would glorify
such anti-war sentiments, especially at a time like now where it is most
important to have the country behind President Bush and the War on
Terrorism. You are only giving more hope to the anti-gun and anti-war
nuts. These are the same people who said they were unscathed by the
September 11th attacks yet at the same time say we should not hurt the
Taliban. 1/17/02Sally [e-mail] found the program
very interesting and was glad to see it aired. It is important to hear
viewpoints that are not viewed by mainstream America. It was good to hear,
from the few interviewed, their experinces, including those from the Amish
and Quaker faiths. I was, however, disappointed to see that there
was no representation of one of the largest groups of Consciencious
Objectors in America and the world. They were known during WWII as the
International Bible Students, today known as Jehovah's Witnesses. In
America they were imprisoned and attacked, physically and verbally by
clergymen of prominant churches. In Britian they were put in prison or in
labratories, analyzing coal dust. In Germany they were put in the
concentration camps along with other objectors and the Jews. They were the
only group in the German concentration camps who could obtain their
freedom by denouncing their faith in writing. Only a few took this
advantage, but most of the thousands inprisoned, stayed true to their
faith. This group is still being persecuted for their nuetral stand
against the politacal elements of this world and not to harm another
human, since they believe love for one another is the defining factor of
their faith. The country of Georgia is a good example. 1/16/02Larry Gara [e-mail]
more than 40 years teaching history, as a World War II resister, I
realized that an important part of that history has been virtually
invisible. My wife and I decided to edit a book of short memoirs by other
resisters and it was published as A Few Small Candles: War Resisters of
World War II Tell Their Stories. I thought it was good to have the
documentary which also helps make this part of American History visible. I
was especially glad that it showed that the reisters and the draftees had
a lot in common. It was not a Good War to those who had to engage in it
nor to those who resisted it and tried to fight for freedom from war
itself. 1/16/02Stanley Campbell [e-mail] learned to
hate war in Vietnam. I came back from that war and protested along with
others, pacifists included. I found that I had greater credibility because
I was a veteran, but I was educated by them, especially the
Quakers.I thoroghly enjoyed your program, the Good War. What a
moving and wonderfully produced documentary! I especially liked how the
film followed the timeline of the war, giving the responses of the
pacifists to the events of the day. It was not maudlin, but was exciting
and interesting and moved well. 1/16/02Carol Knapp [e-mail] I
watched the whole program, I waited in vain for any mention at all of 1 of
the staunchest CO groups - Jehovah's Witnesses. Other church groups are
mentioned, why not them???Even though concidered ordained
ministers, almost none where given a ministerial exemption. Thousands were
imprisoned in every country affected by the war, starting with Germany in
1936. Hitler vowed to "exterminate this brood". Even though many
were in the camps with the Jews, and several hundred were executed for
their faith, by the end of the war there were about twice as many
Witnesses as at the begining. The Witnesses in this country were
no less persecuted. If not imprisoned for refusing to fight their
"brothers" in faith, many were cruely beaten and some killed by
nationalistic mobs. Even the children suffered. During the late 30s thru
the early 40s, many Witness children were denied schooling for the simple
reason that they refused to salute the flag (as they still refuse to do in
every country they are in). The US Supreme Court finally ruled that they
(and all of us) have that right.So how can you have a program on
COs and not even mention Jehovah's Witnesses??? 1/16/02Are conscientious objectors heroes or cowards?
They're certainly not cowards. It takes courage, regardless of whether you
chose to be a CO or a soilder, to stand up and fight for your beliefs.
Furthermore, society recognizes that it is an honorable act for a person
to be willing to undergo imprisonment or death to protect their beliefs.
Why should COs be any different from soilders in this regard? On a related
note, as a legal researcher, I found it fascinating, and couldn't help but
wonder, why the film completely neglected to include any information on
the history of Jehovah's Witnesses, a group with a long-standing history
as concientious objectors? 1/15/02Nick Bertoni said it best, "great film, long
overdue, service to humanity." To have captured these people on film will,
no doubt, provide inspiration and guidance to people for years to come.
Even if some affiliates are showing it at 4:00am today this production
will last to be treasured tomorrow. 1/16/02Helen A. Spalding [e-mail] was so grateful to
see this subject addressed, especially at this time. During the Vietnam
action, I was active in the anti-war movement and assisted young men who
wanted to avoid the draft in making the journey to Canada. During
subsequent times of pressure by the US to force young people into murder,
our family decided that if any of our boys were to recieve notification to
report, the entire family would move to Canada, where my husband had
relatives. I feel that those who refuse to kill are following the
prompting of thier own value systems, whether sacred or secular. I don't
understand how those who call themseves "pro-life" can in good faith
suppport the taking of human life in war. Timothy McVeigh was trained in
the military and was a decorated soldier. His statement that the children
who died in the bombing of the Federal Building were "collateral damage"
is exactly what the military calls civilian deaths from errant or
not-so-errant bombs. It was interesting to me that in the most recent
bombing attacks the first bombs fell on the UN mission to remove land
mines and the Red Cross. I don't feel that this was in any way
unintended.Wars against civilians at home or abroad are equaly
egregious, and those who refuse to participate are equally heroic. War
takes many forms, and the current complicity of our own un-elected
government in the goals of the terrorists to make drastic changes in the
freedoms guaranteed by our constitution is scary and horrifying. Those who
flew the planes have won to the extent that the freedoms and protections
of our constitution are abrogated by those in power.I'm of mixed
mind about alternative service. Some people feel that it is still a way of
assisting the military indirectly, while others would do it anyway. Some
see it as a forced taking of their freedom. Each person must examine and
clarify their own values about this. However, if one truely loves one's
country, there is an OBLIGATION to speak out wh en it is doing a wrong
thing. I consider it analgous to the obligation to stop a beloved child
from running into the street. One shows one's love stopping the child, not
by allowing the chjild to proceed on a wrong path! I'm sorry this is so
long. Thank you for permitting me to speak out on ths subject.
1/16/02Carolyn Bettes [e-mail]
and thank you for your program. I watched the PBS special last night with
great interest. My dad was a CO in WWII serving some time at Wellstone,
which I believe was a CCC camp in northern Michigan, then after walking
out, was sentenced to 2 1/2 years at El Reno Federal Reformatory. His
sponsor and advisor was Dr. Henry Hitt Crane, of Detriot's Central
Methodist Church. I believe he was the advisor to other COs and often
spoke on the subject. I would be interested to hear from anyone who is
familiar with Dr. Crane, Wellstone or El Reno.I think there is
more to this story. 1/16/02Rachel De Nys [e-mail] a
daughter of Vietnam War contientious objectors and draft counselors, I've
long considered COs to be heroes. However, in the wake of 9/11, my
pacifist stance has gotten a beating. But thanks to your film I have a new
resolve to stand up for the truth of peace, and of the value of every
human life. I believe the only way to promote peace is to encourage
rational dialogue with people of every belief, and this film helps fortify
my courage to stand up and speak out for mine. 1/16/02Jane Little [e-mail]'m one of us
short-changed Floridians (via WEDU-Tampa) who decided to stay up to see
this program. I'm very glad I did, and if they rerun it (probably at some
other ungodly hour), I'll do the same!As a baby-boomer, I never
learned much about the CO's of WWII, but this program brought into focus a
particular link between them & a group of CO's I met as a college
student in the late '60s during the Viet Nam War.I was a religion
major at Conn. College, and a group of us went to NYC for a weekend
conference at Union Theological Seminary. My most vivid memory is of an
intense after-hours discussion with a group of seminary students who had
turned in their draft cards. Seminary students were (as I recall) mainly
exempt from the draft. But some UTS students had pondered the social
inequities that were part & parcel of the '60s draft rules.
These students decided that they couldn't reconcile their faith
& its principles with either their exempted status, nor with their
opposition to the U.S. war against Viet Nam. So, by turning in their draft
cards, they resolved both issues simultaneously -- with unknown
repercussions. (If anyone can tell me, I'd appreciate it!) The WWII-era
CO's at Union Theological Seminary -- so well covered in this program --
most certainly contributed to these students' effort a generation later.
The contributions of CO's to reforming the treatment of mental patients
was a total revelation to me. Astounding! One last remark, about
where the serendipity really kicked in: The 2nd part of the Ken Burns
program on Mark Twain appeared just before this program. It had this
comment from a historian, and I realized it applies just as well to the
historical impact of CO's in America as it does to the life of Sam Clemens
(who "skedaddled" from the Civil War, by the way):"Nothing changes
at the center. Change only occurs at the edges and works its way
in."1/16/02constance viar [e-mail] watched "The
Good War and those who refused to fight it" last night on my local pbs
station. I never knew about the WWII COs before. I felt the COs showed
great courage in standing up for their believes. I, myself, do not beleive
in taking another human life, but I have never voiced my belief about
this. I have seen peace groups in my home town demostrating for peace
after 9.11, and I thought they showed a great deal of courage during these
difficult times and secretly I wished to join them but was afraid of the
repercussions. The broadcast has given me the strength to take a stand and
voice my believes, thank you. 1/16/02 JEANNETTE_BAIRWhen and how can I purchase a
copy of The Good War?((To purchase a home video copy of THE GOOD
WAR And Those Who Refused To Fight It, contact Transit Media:
800-343-5540, fax: [phone]. For educational sales contact Bullfrog
Films: 800-543-FROG, fax: [phone], [e-mail] )) 1/16/02Charles Mumpower [e-mail] think
that conscientious objectors are heroes. They are the warroirs for peace.
The weapon they use is peace. It kills no one and it is a lot cheaper.
Simply minded it my sound but peace isn't a complex thing. It all starts
with the individual. Take a look at the home front. We are at war with
ourselves. We have our own people blowing buildings up. Our children are
taking guns into school and killing one another. What else do you expect
to get when people let their kids learn there values from TV and Music.
The most amazing thing about humans is that no matter what type of
enviroment that you put them in, they adapt. You are a product of your
enviroment. Take a look at the people that choose to live in a tribal
community. Take a look at Native Americans before someone ran them off
from there land. Before the "outside" world tainted there whole existants
they were peaceful people and not the savages that our schools teach our
kids they are. They didn't need a government or have to worry about
getting a job in an economy that is about to collapse. They pulled
together as a whole to survive. I doubt that many of use today can survive
through a light winter just living off the land like our anchestors did. I
have done a lot of research about our native anchestors and learned that
they shared their most personal items to one another. Strangers were also
treated in the same respect. Would you give up your car keys to a person
that you didn't even know? Would you even hand them over to a family
member that could use that car more than you? 1/16/02William Gruber [e-mail] was deeply
troubled by this documentary, and its virtually unquestioning
glorification of the conscientious objectors of World War II.Isn't
it nice that these men grew old to become college professors and peace
activists. We needn't mention the men who had no opportunity to grow old
because they fought and died to protect the COs' right to maintain their
intellectual "higher ground."The only counterpoints presented in
the program are portrayed as the ravings of closed-minded, hateful people
-- like the strident-sounding narration of a letter written by a woman
opposing the objectors. The very choice of such a voice for narration
reveals the program's obvious bias.I am a longtime, strong
supporter of PBS and am considered by my friends to be a die-hard liberal.
But a program such as this demonstrates why PBS programming often is
viewed as left-wing in the extreme.Yes, there is a time for
nonviolent resistance. Ghandi and Martin Luther King were heroes for the
changes they effected through nonviolent protest in domestic affairs. But
World War II was not a time to stand on altruistic principle in the face
of such abject horror and aggression. What would have happened to these
objectors if Germany had won the war? Men and women who served protected
them from that fate. Despite the example of the handful of men who
subjected themselves to medical experiments, most conscientious objectors
remained safe at home while others fought to protect them. To see them, in
old age, portrayed as some kind of heroic figures is nauseating when one
thinks of all those who never lived to old age because they were willing
to do the unthinkable to protect the rest of us from tyranny.Shame
on PBS for its unquestioning endorsement of these people and for focusing
on the few who made real sacrifices. Eternal thanks to those who faced
fear and their own conscientious objections to preserve a country in which
selfish pseudo-intellectuals could shirk their duty and live out long
lives without fear of the kind of oppression that would have been certain
under German or Japanese rule. 1/16/02Steve [e-mail] are
ahead of their time. They are courageous prophets calling us to a way that
we all know must prevail if human civilization is to survive on this small
blue planet. War results in only short-term solutions and a false sense of
security. In the long run the logic of war is that we are surrounded and
threatened by the very weapons we created to defend ourselves. Today, even
a small group of individuals can threaten mass death. As Martin Luther
King, Jr., once said: "Either we learn to live together as brothers (and
sisters), or we will perish together as fools." The choice is each of ours
to make, and let's not wait too long to make it. 1/16/02R. Duncan Bond http://www.pbs.org/itvs/thegoodwar/[e-mail]
you so very much for airing this timely & wonderful piece on the fight
for sanity from these true American heroes of WW-2. I say this as the son
of a man who bravely took part in the fight of WW2 as a war participant. I
applaude your bravery and stance for SANITY by airing this program during
a most difficult and confusing time. Thank you very much. PS- The
Mark Twain Special was also a great thing to air. Thanks for it.
1/16/02Jennifer Chen http://www.pbs.org/itvs/thegoodwar/[e-mail]
work! Only PBS has the guts to tell the dark side of the "great" war. CO
is not heroe nor cowad but dreamer. War is been used by politicians as
their gloried message. Do we know how many Sentors children died in the
war? Alterntive service is needed but alternative education is a must. I
would like to see politicians to take standard test in music, art,
history, language, law (if it did exist) not a bomb test but I am a
dreamer. 1/16/02http://www.pbs.org/itvs/thegoodwar/[e-mail]
you for airing this show. My grandfather was a CO during World War II and
I have never had the history to understand his decision in context of his
generation. "The Good War" was the first piece I have seen to provide
this. 1/16/02Thank you for the excellent and
informative program about Pacifism of Conscientious Objectors in the US in
WWII. I hadnot known much about this period of US history and its positive
and far reaching impact on the Peace and civil rights movement as well as
the role played by COs in humanitarian assistance during the war as medics
and after the war to the people of Europe. My father, rest his soul, was a
Canadian pacifist of sorts and I suspect were others of my family who
served as medics and other non- combatant roles. I would like to find out
about the history of COs in Canada and other Allied countries during
WWII.This program has brought me closer to an appreciation of my
father and my family instead of the confusion of shame which has
surrounded the issue. God bless your continued efforts to bring the light
of knowledge to the corners of TV and its viewers. 1/16/02Johnny [e-mail] your subject of
'Conscientious objectors' Some of the Men spoke of the 'Right'of every one
to live and how could they possably take the life of another one as it's
inhuman. I wonder what they think, and are they ashamed since now we know
the really 'INHUMAN' things the enemy was doing to so many inisent Men
Women and children? Also the "CO'S" complained about POOR conditions in
their camp's and when they volinteered for medical testing they did'nt
relize they were risking their lives. Well ALL Soilders had bad living
conditions and all KNEW they were risking their lives (in which a much
higher percenage died) I find it offensive in portraying these 'Men' in
some sort of sympithetic light when so many men (who also disliked the
idea of killing)did what was expected of them. And thank God for it.
1/16/02Toni [e-mail]'m
sure Hitler's Germany would have wished we had a lot more Conscientious
Objectors. Thank God that we have had a society that has a real view of
what is sacred and what is worth fighting for. If you lay down and do
nothing with your head in the clouds wishing we could all be happy and at
peace, then be prepared for the consquences of those who will take
advantage of that pacifism. It will not be comfortable and it will not be
freedom. Wishing in one hand and hoping in the other may disarm you, but
not the person that wants to dominate you. 1/16/02Bernardo Vallejo [e-mail]
I think of pacifists during WWII is that of respect. when someone goes to
a phycical conflict unwilling to confront the enemy, is more likely that
they may diminish the moral of the rest of the soldiers through negative
behavour. Idealism is of great conflict for those have the need to
believe in certain straggle.when someone rejects the idea of dying for
something which do not represent his beliefs is because this persone lives
his own live and not others who are willing to die cluelessly but
patriotic.Politics most of the time is what drives countries to
war so, why not to sent the politicians to fight against each other intead
of the people. 1/16/02Bob Berman [e-mail]
years Oregon Public Broadcasting has aired many documentaries on World War
II. Without exception, they all have shimmered with the glow of the good
war. And, they have all aired at primetime. Now, with the only alternative
voice I can remember about to be shown on OPB, it was determined that the
11:00 P.M. slot on a weeknight would be the best time for it! 1/15/02I am concerned that a documentary with such
vital questions to raise is not been shown on my local PBS station. Thses
are important issues for us as US citizens to consider, I am shocked that
we here in Chapel Hill will not be able to be a part of that larger
dialog. Who is responsible for making that decesion for us?((
UNC-TV Programming Dept responds: UNC-TV produces over 350 hours of
programming that must be fit into their schedule each year. To place any
of this programming in prime time, other programs must be preempted or
moved to a later broadcast date. Usually this happens to programs like THE
GOOD WAR that PBS has not designated for "common carriage."-- "Common
carriage" programs are shows PBS has placed special emphasis on promoting
and has asked stations to carry on the same evening they are released
nationally.)) 1/15/02Alan [e-mail] George Orwell said,
many pacifists mock the uniforms that guard them while they sleep.
An action must be judged, at least in part, by its consequences,
not whether it was done in "good faith" [Hitler probably acted in "good
faith", but his actions/consequences should be judged "evil".] If it were
up to the pacifists, all European Jews and communists (and probably
pacifists) would have been murdered in concentration camps and American
blacks might still be slaves. Someone (Blake?) said that all that is
necessarily for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing. If an act
leads to evil consequences, how can the act be "good" or
"moral".The above does NOT apply to those who served as medics.
1/15/02Lauri Rowe [e-mail] am a relatively
newcomer to the CO movement as I got my training as a CO counselor in 1983
and used it extensively during the Persian Gulf "War". Now that I am a
mother of one teenage girl and one 7 year old boy, I feel more compelled
to pass on the word of peace for the children of our future. It is a very
scary time we live in and speaking out in our small midwestern town can
get you harassed, but we cannot waver from the truth. Thank you to PBS for
having the courage to run this show. Our station out of Lansing MI is
planning on broadcasting it Tuesday, January 15th at 10pm. Good luck and
may peace be with you all. 1/15/02W Lee Miller http://www.pbs.org/itvs/thegoodwar/[e-mail]
"unburying" this most important part of our history. As a child during the
Vietnam war, I wondered whether anyone had ever protested wars before (the
media made it seem that this was a "new thing") -- it took much digging in
my late teen years and early adulthood to learn even a small part of the
truth that has been so buried. That EVERY war this country has ever been a
part of has had those supreme Men of Conscience -- braver than any
combatant -- who are willing to stand on their beliefs and reject the
orders to kill. Asminov's dictim "violence is the last refuge of the
incompetent" is proven so obviously whenever any person has the strength
to endure -- truly endure -- and stand so under the incompetent hatred and
violence of their fellow men.Again thank you. One can only hope
that even a small percentage of our youth today will see this film and
learn of men who should truly be examples. Again, thank you. 1/15/02Thank you for having the courage to air this
documentary....I am looking forward to seeing it. 1/15/02Seyn Laproyen [e-mail] applaud all
those who made this program possible (starting with the COs, of course),
and congratulate WNET for airing it today. At the same time, I must
express my sadness that programs like this were not produced and aired
decades ago...As a conscientious objector myself, I feel that we
also need to acknowledge the presence of many (unnamed) people who are
willing to fight in certain 'armed' conflicts, but insist on doing so by
methods _circumscribed by their own code_, rather than the code dictated
by nation-states or empires. In other words, even if we disagree with
them, even if we feel we know better than them, we should bring to the
discussion those (potentially) volunteer fighters who are not, or do not
wish to be a part of national armed forces.We are aware of the
example of 'Lincoln Brigade' (who, when they joined the US armed forces,
were kept from front-line positions). We must also be aware that many
people were willing to interfere in Bosnia much sooner than West ern
powers finally decided to send forces. There were also many who would be
willing to militarily interfere in Somalia much sooner, and many who would
put their lives at risk in Rwanda...While some preach love for
one's enemies, there are some, like me, who are prepared to defend the
innocent, and where necessary, _kill for peace_. While some argue that it
would be morally objectionable even to shoot down the airplanes that
dropped A-Bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki, and brought the nuclear threat
on virtually all human beings on this planet, there are some
'pacifists'/peacemakers who would have no difficulty killing as many
nuclear scientists, political leaders, industrialists, generals, admirals,
and other military men and women it takes to lift the nuclear threat from
humankind, for now and for our future. 1/15/02Phil Runkel [e-mail]
forward to seeing the program tonight. Here at the Marquette Archives we
seek to document the witness of Catholic pacifists and COs--especially
Catholic Workers such as Dorothy Day and Arthur Sheehan. We would
appreciate hearing from anyone with relevant letters, photographs, and
other records. Phil RunkelCatholic Worker
ArchivistDepartment of Special Collections and University
ArchivesMarquette University1415 W. Wisconsin Ave.PO Box
3141Milwaukee, WI 53201-3141414-288-7256 1/15/02Eric Longley [e-mail]: What
do you think of conscientious objectors? In your opinion, are they heroes
or cowards?REPLY: They are heroes if they resist conscription.
They are cowards, fools or time-servers if they acquiesce in the phony
"alternative service" system arranged by the government, with the
regrettable collaboration of some of the peace churches. Pacifists have
resisted double and triple-taxation as a "penalty" for obeying God and
refusing to fight. When you cut through the rhetoric, "alternative
service" is morally indistinguishable from double-or triple-taxation,
since it is a burden imposed on pacifists purely because they obey God and
refuse to participate in war. Any pacifist who pays double taxes, or who
volunteers for "alternative service," is accepting that the government may
impose conditions on a person's obediance to God. Only God, not the
government, may hold people accountable for obeying Him, and no form of
alternat ive service is licit if it applies only to pacifists who are
fulfilling their God-given duty to resist war in all its
manifestations.QUESTION: Is there a difference in being a pacifist
when the war is being fought abroad than when the war is waged at home and
against civilians? REPLY: No.QUESTION: Do you consider
alternative service a valid contribution in times of war? ANSWER:
No. QUESTION: Do dissenters have an obligation to keep quiet or
speak up when our nation is in crisis?ANSWER: The obligation to
speak against war varies from person to person, and depends on when and
whether God has given that person a call to speak. The opinion of the
government, one's neighbors, etc. is completely irrelevant and should not
be considered in this context.QUESTION: What do you think of the
perspectives of WWII COs to the terrorist attacks of 9.11?ANSWER:
I don't know what WWII COs think of 9/11, because my local station hasn't
even set a date for the airing of t his program, although they say they
will air it later this year. I would pose a question of my own: Pacifists
oppose the killing of the Pentagon because pacifists oppose the
destruction of human life for social ends, even in a country's military
headquarters. My question is how *militarists* can oppose the attack on
the Pentagon, except on the grounds that the people in the Pentagon are
engaged in righteous activities which should not be interfered with? What
arguments can militarists make against the destruction of the Pentagon, if
they are required to make their argument in universal terms? They cannot
make such an argument. The pacifists can. 1/15/02Dr. Leah Rogne [e-mail] am
excited about the appearance of this film, which I will get a chance to
see tonight. In 1999 I completed my Ph.D. dissertation, titled "The Social
Contexts of Persistence: Life Stories of World War II Conscientious
Objectors and War Resisters," It is a collection of life stories from nine
Twin Cities pacifists who each continued their peace and justice activity
through a 45-50 year adult lifespan. It would be available through the
University Michigan dissertation service, and I would be glad for anyone
interested in the topic to be able to read the extensive life stories and
analysis. The people I interviewed, including Professor Mulford Sibley and
others who were influential locally and/or nationally over their
lifetimes, were a great inspiration to me and I hope they will be for
others. Please feel free to contact me at [e-mail].
1/15/02It's ironic that the reason PBS can
make such a documentary as this (free press, speech, etc) is because of
the very citizens that DID answer the call of their government and go to
war. The efforts of those men and women ensured that our liberty would
continue to stand. Like so many other things described in Ecclesiastes
3:1-8, there is a time for war, and a time for peace. 1/15/02Nick McAleerIt looks like a facinating
program, "The Good War and Those Who Refused to Fight It". Unfortunately
it is airing at 3:00 am and 4:00 am in the morning at WEDU,
Tampa/St.Petersburg/Sarasota. Not very courageous for a "public"
broadcasting station. I think their integrity has been compromised, which
is unfortunate because they do have programing you can't find any where
else I will stay up or tape it. Thanks NM 1/14/02Melinda Box I appreciate the risk the
producers have taken in making this documentary. I imagine it must have
been a powerful experience to put it together. I also appreciate the
comments of George Hauser. I agree that it's so easy to believe doing
right and good will bring positive changes to the world around us. The
truth is it may, but it may also provoke an ostracizing backlash.
Sometimes society finds the pain of its own conscience so unbearable it
drives an individual out. Perhaps by killing him or her, through
assassination, crucifiction, or martyring. Sometimes it drives people out
by discrediting them, or sending them to prisons, or barring them from
sustaining or fulfilling work. As a result the commitment to conscience
must be made for the benefit of one's own soul. Those who commit for the
benefit of changing the world around them will encounter burn-out,
confusion, and discouragement. Those who commit for themselves will
experience peace and security. This documentary has been uplifting to me
as I seek to learn from the experiences of others who followed their
consciences. Thank you for giving this to us! 1/14/02It's about time that TV and other media
outlets started to support peace rather than glorifying war and violence.
It's unfortunate that we've had to wait so long for a mainstream media
outlet to acknowledge the important part played by those committed to
peace. I praise the people behind the program, but I think those in the
media who have worked to silence the voices of peace should be ashamed. I
look forward to this program with hope that it will make a difference in
the lives of many. 1/14/02Art Toegemann The Selective Service fails
this subject by requiring an absolute pacificism. Truth is the first
casuality of war, again, when the SS injures the meaning, denoted, of
"conscientious"; see any reputable dictionary, and how our military strays
far from it.My experience is not from WWII or Henry David Thoreau,
but from the war in Vietnam. I am defamed, still, as unfit, i.e., insane,
for refusing to fight in, and indeed, objecting to that war. I have
evidence that my attempts to correct this record led to the murder,
recorded as medical accident, of one of my senators, John Chafee,
RI.To my subject line: additionally, the American Psychiatric
Association and the World Health Organization fail our very consciousness
when they defame parapsychology as schizophrenia, in their texts The
Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders and The
International Classification of Diseases, respectively.This is how
we fail conscience and consciousness, both a priority. Knowing this
undermines any morale for that most dubious of actions, war. 1/8/02John Amstutz Having taking a similar
position during a later era (1962) and having worked in a psychiatric
hospital for those two years, I was impressed to hear from the training
instructor that the CO's had pioneered reform in psychiatric care. One of
the outcomes of this pioneering change was the establishment of Mennonite
Mental Health Services, a model provider of modernized psychiatric
services. My father, Dr. H. Clair Amstutz (also a CO) was chairman of the
national board of MMHS for 25 years. Of special interest in the website
presentation were the experiences of Professors Sam Yoder and Lester
Glick, both of whom I have known personally, along with many other
Mennonite CO's of that era. 1/8/02Douglas MartinI have not seen it yet and I
already appreciate it. Conscientious objectors should be considered
heroes. If I were to get enthusiastic about the slogan "United we Stand"
then it would have to be thinking about standing united as conscientious
objectors to war. I wave an American Flag for those that have sacrificed
so much to try to communicate to the world that there is a better way, to
those that stand on there principles in order to wage a peacful war on
war. It does not matter where the war is, be it abroad or in our own back
yard, we need people to take a conscientious stand. People who can see
beyond the moment. People that question the use of violence and killing as
a way to solve problems. Alternative service should be a respected valid
contribution in times of war and in times of peace. I shall
interject a question of my own: What if we required young udults in this
country to undergo training and service not in the skills and techniques
of war, but instead in the training of the so desperatly needed skills
that can lead us to peace. Can we channel our tax dollars that way? As to
the perspectives of WWII CO's: They speak my thoughts well.Thank You
1/8/02Ann Carrigan I look forward to
this program, and have done so since I first became aware of it. It's been
mentioned in my Quaker Meeting for some time. So, I was very disappointed
to see on the broadcast schedule that my local PBS station, WJCT in
Jacksonville, is only planning to air the show at 3am and 4am. The same is
true for Gainesville affiliate WUFT (available on cable here), and many,
many affiliates around the country. I realize that the United States is
currently engaged in a large military action, and that stations may be
worried about public perception of airing such a program at such a time.
But, public broadcasting is not known for wavering in such circumstances,
and I feel that the story of conscientious objectors deserves to be told.
As a person whose faith leads me to believe that human beings killing
other human beings is always wrong, I say that the present is absolutely
the right time to present this perspective...not to pretend it doesn't
exist or to bury it in the wee hours. I intend to contact my local
affiliates and make them aware of local interest in the program. Thanks
for your time.Sincerely, Ann Carrigan 1/6/02Nick BertoniThis is a great film.Long
overdue.I think that you have done a great service to humanity.
1/6/02Stephen Allen SmalleyQ: What
do you think of conscientious objectors? In your opinion, are they heroes
or cowards?Who is the 'hero' , one who is willing to kill, maim,
and terrorize others in the name of God and country, or one who refuses to
do so for any reason whatsoever? Who is the 'coward' , one who stands
alone - even in the face of enormous hostility - and refuses to conform to
the accepted morality (so-called) of the day, or one who willingly allows
himself to be led, unquestioning, to slaughter fellow human
beings?Q: Is there a difference in being a pacifist when the war
is being fought abroad than when the war is waged at home and against
civilians?Is there a difference in the action that you take in
either circumstance, whether in one country or another? Is it okay to kill
someone because he is on 'your' property? Is that person any less dead?
Are you any less responsible for his death?Q: Do you consider
alternative service a valid contribution in times of war?Not if
that 'service' contributes in any way to the machinery of war
itself.Q: Do dissenters have an obligation to keep quiet or speak
up when our nation is in crisis?The primary obligation of any
individual is to respond to a 'crisis' as he himself sees fit, whether or
not that response fits in with any so-called national
interest.







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